tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post6891312406812083451..comments2024-03-25T22:48:31.750-04:00Comments on Dreams in the Lich House: Defending The HorrorJohnhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18031181424520125213noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-46804512384865382572011-06-16T09:23:27.438-04:002011-06-16T09:23:27.438-04:00To me, horror in an RPG has nothing to do with bei...To me, horror in an RPG has nothing to do with being visceral or gory necessarily. Horror is stepping outside of a psychological comfort zone. In a typical "horror" film, the protagonist(s) is typically confronted with something outside his experience or "normal" ability to deal with. <br /><br />That's why "Alien" is a horror movie and "Aliens" is an action movie. In the first film, what are basically a bunch of oil rig workers in space have to face a terrifying creature. The marines in the 2nd film are facing terrible foes, but they have the skills, mindset, and tools to deal with them. Heck, they must shoot/blow up at least a few dozen of them before the end.<br /><br />In a fantasy game like D&D, your PCs are <i>usually</i> quite capable of dealing with something big & hairy that might jump out of the dark at them. Heck, that's practically in their job descriptions! Horror in these instances is where the normal (for them) isn't good enough.<br /><br />Zombie apocalypse stories are popular for this because the threat can turn former friends into the enemy. "Save the last bullet for yourself!"and the like. The sense of doom, the feeling that –even if you survive– things won't ever be "OK" again. That "discomfort" is the source of horror. Not the rotting corpses shuffling around the streets.<br /><br />Adventures where the PCs can't win conventionally, or "winning" means picking a lesser evil. Those are more likely to fit the Horror label, IMO.Bigharahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14232940345429292782noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-79256982314538521462011-06-16T07:52:13.548-04:002011-06-16T07:52:13.548-04:00@Greg: You're holding up Call of Cthulhu as m...@Greg: You're holding up Call of Cthulhu as mainstream horror, but there are similar things in various Call of Cthulhu adventures to the infamous demon-vagina. And Delta Green goes much farther. So did much of the Sabbat-oriented World of Darkness stuff (my group at the time ran a coterie of Tzimisce Sabbat torturers - all ordinary folks with good day jobs that went all 'reservoir dogs' during game time).<br /><br />The difference here is that much of D&D's corporate focus has been sanitary for as long as the suits are calling the shots; now that the game is in the hands of hobbyists, we can make products that match how we actually play the game (at least, what I'm getting from these limited comments are that folks think horror antagonists are totally fair game).<br /><br />@Antion: my buddy Felt likes horror but isn't a huge fan of drawing gross-out stuff; when I get closer to having the manuscript done I may appeal to the OSR community of artists for some help, and some of these pieces could be edgier - a few of the bosses planned for the deeper levels are a bit grotesque.<br /><br />@Stuart: Yes! Turning a dead PC into a zombie, after being left behind in the dungeon not blessed/buried properly, is excellent - definitely have used that one as well.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18031181424520125213noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-1664902723965284402011-06-16T04:43:23.350-04:002011-06-16T04:43:23.350-04:00I say we need horror to remind us of how good our ...I say we need horror to remind us of how good our lives actually are, and to make the light and bright worthwhile and something to aim for.Simon Forsterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01243845335993440168noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-16540122254706674742011-06-16T04:31:12.283-04:002011-06-16T04:31:12.283-04:00I've always preferred demons as formless soul-...I've always preferred demons as formless soul-eating horrors rather than big tough boss monsters made out of bits of stuff (that'll be all that Earthsea influence). Helps to differentiate them a bit, I find; a demon doesn't need to be a big scary grobble-monster because it can find one to possess, seduce, co-erce or bribe into doing its big scary grobble-monster duties for it. Having a demon aboard might make the grobble-monster more grobbly (that'll be all that old Warhammer influence) as telegraphy - but that's still not as scary as someone who looks pretty ordinary but is a seething hive of demonic foulness underneath.Vonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12583821960347555993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-42858142043945166242011-06-16T01:02:56.311-04:002011-06-16T01:02:56.311-04:00While it's been fun bashing on Raggi and DCC a...While it's been fun bashing on Raggi and DCC all week, I'd certainly like to see folks put up some art they think can cover the same material (keeping in mind the art director's intended responses) without being offensive or "crossing the line" or whatever. Of course, that assumes the original goal wasn't simply to offend some people and start discussions (which I find extremely like).<br /><br />None of the art you've associated with the Black City has squicked me out so far (not that I think it would be a bad thing if it did), yet you state you aspire to similar things. Either you're doing something different, or you need to post more art ;)Nobodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08553033903110391188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-84180460108782325252011-06-16T00:22:35.032-04:002011-06-16T00:22:35.032-04:00I think there is a definite place for horror in th...I think there is a definite place for horror in the mainstream of RPGs. Cthulu has been around since the beginning. Vampire is horror. This stuff is mainstream.<br /><br />That said, I think there is a common art standard beyond which gaming books should be discouraged from crossing.Pontifexhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01761338487255048337noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-81477632640135202342011-06-15T23:42:28.376-04:002011-06-15T23:42:28.376-04:00In our 2nd B/X D&D game I rolled a wandering m...In our 2nd B/X D&D game I rolled a wandering monster in the Crypt section where the party had previously lost a retainer and buried him under a pile of stones in a desecrated temple.<br /><br />I rolled a Zombie.<br /><br />Random encounters can sometimes be awesome! :)Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13457050225967190052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-53373396374461292642011-06-15T23:37:47.883-04:002011-06-15T23:37:47.883-04:00"Give your players something worthy of fighti..."Give your players something worthy of fighting."<br /><br />Amen. In a recent game we spent an entire session battling random encounters. I finally threw up my hands and cried, "Enough!" <br /><br />Like you say, give the intrepid explorers a worthy foe!christianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09650456794111980661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-45436893707198976582011-06-15T21:10:21.552-04:002011-06-15T21:10:21.552-04:00Horror has always been a part of my fantasy games....Horror has always been a part of my fantasy games. I really think it's hard for characters to "heroic" without that challenge.Anthonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01254215329246851683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-54117916090675050112011-06-15T21:10:06.884-04:002011-06-15T21:10:06.884-04:00As to whether articles like the one about the Uncl...As to whether articles like the one about the Unclean Spirits cross some kind of line, I don't think so. It's a game, we know it's a game, and using Biblical-style demons is no more an insult to Bible believers than playing Squad Leader is an insult to veterans of World War II.<br /><br />Individual play groups need to decide what is allowed at their table. Bloggers, game designers, and so on should write what interests them and respect their audiences by understanding that we're capable of making our own judgments.Uncle Darkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15153259977898899885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-12947094221986632552011-06-15T20:58:58.831-04:002011-06-15T20:58:58.831-04:00Yeah, I think horrors fairly well in the mainstrea...Yeah, I think horrors fairly well in the mainstream of D&D inspirations. :)Treyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04647628467658839351noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4353391426294254427.post-85548516066779503832011-06-15T20:52:00.748-04:002011-06-15T20:52:00.748-04:00I get a lot of inspiration from horror films for m...I get a lot of inspiration from horror films for my D&D games. If the players run into Zombies they usually end up running away - not necessarily because of the stats either.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13457050225967190052noreply@blogger.com